Robot 6 has an excellent roundtable up about girls and fandom and the drama over Twilight “invading” comic-con. I’m posting a few excerpts here, with my thoughts, but you really should read the whole thing.
Robin Brenner: I find it especially distressing that the SDCC crowd, made up of fans who have been typically dismissed and marginalized by the larger culture including comics fans, fantasy fans, and sci-fi fans, seem to think it’s perfectly warranted to dump on fans who you would think they have a lot more in common with than traits to divide them.
I’ve seen this over and over again, though, in groups gathered around everything from punk rock to politics. When you’re marginalized from the larger culture, in part by choice but in a much larger part than we’d like to admit, not by choice, it’s easy to try to police your boundaries. Maybe it even gives you a better sense that you ARE different because you choose to be and not because your peers don’t understand your passion for the Misfits/Dennis Kucinich/Superman/Twilight. In other words, maybe enforcing the “no girls allowed” clubhousey nature of certain parts of comic fandom makes comic fans feel more special. Groups often define themselves by what they aren’t, after all.
Kate Dacey: The other thing that bothers me about these statements is that many of the folks dissing Twilight have never read it or watched the movie, yet they feel perfectly qualified to assess its merits solely on the basis of who likes it. Teen girls love it, ergo it must be junk.
I’ve taken this on myself, and I still believe it’s true. Listen, ain’t no one arguing you have to like Twilight. But if you haven’t read the damn thing, how do you know it’s crap? It sounds entirely too much like the people who go “You read COMIC BOOKS?” at my day job(s).
Eva Volin: The librarian half of my brain wants to sit the fanboys down and explain to them about the birds and the bees, about brain development, and the statistics on reading patterns and buying habits of girls vs. boys. To remind them that teenage girls have expendable incomes, too, and ask if they’d really rather the girls spend that money somewhere else, like at a chain bookstore, or Hot Topic, or on eBay. Or at the booths in the dealers rooms where they sell cell phone charms of Naruto characters or the twins from Ouran High School Host Club. The librarian half of my brain wants to reason with people who would rather stomp their feet than get with the program and embrace this new generation of fan—a generation who, if encouraged, could save the comics industry.
Um, what she said.
Volin, cont’d: That because I have two X chromosomes I need to have sequential art explained to me in small words and if I’m in a comic book shop it must be because I’m there to buy books for my son or nephew. And to all of that I say, “Bite. Me.”
I’m going to SDCC. I’m going to line up to see the panels I’m interested in. I’m going to cheer for the artists whose work I enjoy. I’m going to ask questions and get autographs and maybe even do a little cosplaying. And I’m going to spend money at booths that have the merchandise I’m interested in. Lots of money. And if you don’t want my business, don’t worry. Call it women’s intuition, but I’ll be able to tell. And I’ll remember. And I’ll take my business, as well as my nieces’ and their friends’ business, to someone else’s booth.
Exactly this. Over the years, I’ve grown exceptionally good at navigating comic shops and the varied reactions of the employees/owners. And I remember each clerk who was condescending, who was rude, and I took my money elsewhere. I’m still here, reading and writing about comics, because I love them and I believe in the medium AND the industry. I am quite certain there’s a place for me in this world. But I’d be lying if I didn’t say that some of the most overt sexism I’ve ever dealt with in my life has come my way through comics. And I don’t mean Wonder Woman’s costume.
So, con-goers and fans, think about all of this when you’re at SDCC and you roll your eyes at the squealing teenage girls (and trust me, I don’t like listening to squealing either). Those girls have money and just as much right to be there as you do. And it couldn’t hurt to be nice to them.
July 22nd, 2009 at 2:15 pm
…Listen, ain’t no one arguing you have to like Twilight. But if you haven’t read the damn thing, how do you know it’s crap? It sounds entirely too much like the people who go “You read COMIC BOOKS?” at my day job(s).
Amen to that, Sarah. Most of us have read some or all of the series, and few of us would argue that it’s great literature. At the same time, none of us want to have to distance ourselves from Twilight fans (or publicly diss the books) just to be taken seriously by the tights-and-capes crowd.
Thanks for the linkage and the thoughtful comments!
July 22nd, 2009 at 2:45 pm
“But if you haven’t read the damn thing, how do you know it’s crap?
Well, yeah. Of course.
But that covers ANY book or ANY movie.
Those who go on rants to criticize forms of entertainment that they’ve never watched/read/listened to, etc… have no legs to stand on.
NONE.
I’ve never read Twilight or saw the movie. So I have no opinion about the work
Those who have read/watched it and enjoyed it, good for them.
Isn’t this “Don’t criticize something you’ve never read or seen” one of those no-brainers?
Doesn’t it make perfect logical sense?
Why in the world is this still an issue?
July 22nd, 2009 at 2:53 pm
This may be a silly point, but with all the complaining about accepting the Twilight fans by the comics fanboys, has anybody asked the Twilight fans if they WANT to be accepted by the larger fandom?
From everything I see, the “typical” middle-school Twilight fan turns out to be the kind of high school girl most fanboys don’t like, anyway.
Just a thought.
July 22nd, 2009 at 2:57 pm
The last time Twilight fans gathered in a group large enough to attract media attention, most of the resulting press focused on the near-riots and teenage girls wanting to be bitten by Edward Cullen. I think that’s the concern, that that sort of hysteria added to the already packed SDCC would be a nightmare.
Ideally, everyone will just get along, grab a stack of comics, and enjoy the camaraderie of fandom that the movie studios at the con seek to capitalize on.
July 22nd, 2009 at 3:26 pm
Mountains out of molehills, I think, and if the essayist would like to stop snark, perhaps she shouldn’t be snarky herself. I’m all for the conversation but please have it as adults (and don’t let the “librarian half” act like an elitist snot). It’s amateur.
July 22nd, 2009 at 5:23 pm
I still fail to see how this is a real story. The majority of the issues raised have been about the location and time of the showing. Again, it seems like this is a self-perpetuating story covered by a handful of sites.
Now, if we want to have a discussion on why comics targeted at girls are marginalized, let’s have it. But that has nothing to do with the Twilight situation at SDCC.
Heck, a better discussion would be why we NEED comics that are targeted at girls, as opposed to, say, making mainstream comics more friendly to people who aren’t straight guys.
July 22nd, 2009 at 6:40 pm
No offense to Sarah or anyone discussing this topic elsewhere, but I think that by addressing it too much, you are ultimately stoking the fire and it would be best to just ignore it. This all just seems so silly. Personally, I’d love to see anything not related to comics be kept out of comic book conventions, but SDCC specifically is no longer about comics and so the inclusion of something like TWILIGHT is to be expected.
July 22nd, 2009 at 9:51 pm
I appreciate the fact that all the respondents here and at Robot 6 have been polite in expressing their (dis)agreement with our original post. Thank you.
If you read the message boards at some of the sites that first covered the Twilight story, I think you’d have a greater appreciation for why we did that post. Many of the comments directed at Twilight fans were rude and sexist. Coming on the heels of the LA Times’ “Girls’ Guide to Comic-Con,” in which female readers were advised to check out TV and movie panels featuring “hot” male actors (comics be damned), the Twilight haters’ comments were the proverbial straw that broke the camel’s back. We’re just asking to be treated with the same respect that male fans are — nothing more, nothing less.
As for Kyle’s point, it’s a good one: how do we raise the profile of girls’ comics? We’ve tackled that issue several times at Good Comics for Kids, most recently after the cancellation of Shojo Beat, the only American magazine for female comic readers. There’s no simple answer to this question (as the failure of DC’s Minx imprint attests), but it is one that many, many female critics are actively discussing.
July 22nd, 2009 at 10:18 pm
There should be no such thing as “girls’ comics” or “boys’ comics.” By making the distinction, you’re making the line in the sand bigger. Because both sexes appreciate action or romance to some degree, even if they don’t admit it. Because targeting an audience by relying on stereotypes only perpetuates the myth.
There should simply be comics that don’t adhere to sexist, racist and other -ist conventions. You can’t create equality by pointing fingers. You can only do it when you’re leading by example.
July 23rd, 2009 at 9:35 am
I don’t think there’s anything wrong with creating comics that aim for specific audiences. I just think there needs to be more of a balance, and I think there does need to be more thought and effort put into appealing to female readers. I think the first step is creating female super-heroes that are far more appealing to female readers. The majority of men/young boys who are into comics came to them because of super-heroes, and many have stayed not just for the heroes but also for other genres. I think you can bring women/girls in the same way.
July 23rd, 2009 at 11:17 am
JawaFather: That’s a great point. DC has taken some tentative steps in this direction with series like Supergirl: Cosmic Adventures in the 8th Grade, a tween-friendly take on the character that portrayed her as an awkward middle school student rather than a sexy twenty-something. Generally speaking, however, book publishers, indie comic companies, and manga publishers are doing a much better job of serving girls than the Big Two with series like Fashion Kitty, The War at Ellsmere, Magic Trixie, Days Like This and Kaze Hikaru.
The other thing I’d add is that superheroes are just one avenue into comics. For many younger female comic fans (in the US, at least), it was Tokyopop’s Sailor Moon that got them hooked. Would that still be the case if DC published a Wonder Woman comic for the under-12 set? Hard to say, though I think both manga and superheroes are equally valid introductions comics as a medium.
July 23rd, 2009 at 1:51 pm
The problem with this ‘SDCC/fanboys! Stop being mean to Twilight/fangirls!’, argument is that it conflates a dislike of fangirls and a disrespect for the things they enjoy with a dislike of Twilight — which is a really bad rhetorical assumption to make.
This is the first time in several years I’ve skipped SDCC — and, in my experience, it’s pretty welcoming to fans/geeks of the distaff persuasion. A large portion of the con hall is devoted to Manga/Manhwa/Anime, there are tons of cosplayers for girl-centric/friendly fandoms (Harry Potter, Naruto, etc.), and, unlike Robin Brenner, I’ve seen plenty of ‘glomping’ and tomfoolery with ‘yaoi paddles’ (if you don’t know, best not to ask) on the floor over the last few years.
Personally, I don’t care for shojo manga (though I used to like the Maison Ikokku anime way back in the day), but just like any other subgenre, it has it’s share of good and bad works.
I actually think most ‘adult male fans’ feel the same way: Shojo manga may not be their cup of tea, but no fanboy with an IQ above room temperature would deny that it has a rightful place at an event called ‘Comic-Con International.’
I think the reasons you’re seeing a backlash against ‘Twilight’, as opposed to other girl-centric fandoms boils down to the following:
1)Twilight is so aggressively mainstream that, in fact, many younger fanboys (and not a few fangirls) who have been ‘typically dismissed and marginalized’ are instinctively disdainful of it b/c a large portion of Twilight fandom is composed of the exact same folks who engaged in said dismissing and marginalizing. This is a fandom with a disproportionately large chunk of ‘mean girls’, not another group of geeks seeking common ground.
2)Along those lines, the majority of Twilight fans are openly contemptuous of anything not directly tied to Meyer, Pattinson, or Stewart. ‘I’m only here for Twilight,’ T-shirts were a frequent sight on the floor last year, which is one reason I’m very skeptical of the idea that Twihards represent a potential new comic/manga crossover audience. As fandoms go, it seems to be pretty monomaniacal.
3)Even relative to other hardcore fandoms, Twilight fans are notorious for their bad behavior, as even a brief perusal of Fandom Wank (or, really, any portion of the internet) will make clear.
Bottom line: Liking/respecting fangirls =/= not liking/respecting (extreme) Twilight fangirls* — there’s a BIG difference.
To be fair: I know (and like) a few non-extreme Twilight fangirls, and they’re often the first ones to point out their fellow fangirls’ craziness.
July 23rd, 2009 at 3:33 pm
It’s simple: typical spandex-and-capes comics fanboys are intimidated by, emasculated by, and resentful of women, period.
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