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	<title>Comments on: Everyone&#8217;s A Critic: What we talk about when we&#8217;re not talking about the art</title>
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	<link>http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/09/16/everyones-a-critic-what-we-talk-about-when-were-not-talking-about-the-art/</link>
	<description>Newsarama contributors share what’s on their minds.</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jul 2008 06:31:29 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: MattyK</title>
		<link>http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/09/16/everyones-a-critic-what-we-talk-about-when-were-not-talking-about-the-art/#comment-185009</link>
		<dc:creator>MattyK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Sep 2007 01:46:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/09/16/everyones-a-critic-what-we-talk-about-when-were-not-talking-about-the-art/#comment-185009</guid>
		<description>Maybe it just boils down to Humanity's preoccupation with finding a narrative in every aspect of life.
But it's tempting to blame a specific group of people... even if only to satisfy my preoccupation with finding a narrative in every aspect of my life.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maybe it just boils down to Humanity&#8217;s preoccupation with finding a narrative in every aspect of life.<br />
But it&#8217;s tempting to blame a specific group of people&#8230; even if only to satisfy my preoccupation with finding a narrative in every aspect of my life.</p>
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		<title>By: Jon Hastings</title>
		<link>http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/09/16/everyones-a-critic-what-we-talk-about-when-were-not-talking-about-the-art/#comment-182309</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Hastings</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 Sep 2007 11:23:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/09/16/everyones-a-critic-what-we-talk-about-when-were-not-talking-about-the-art/#comment-182309</guid>
		<description>My thinking has always been that people writing about comics tend to be writers, so it makes sense if they focus on the writing.  Something similar happens in film reviews with regard to the acting: most critics will point out if a performance is good or bad, but they won't go into detail about what the actors are actually doing in the same way they might analyze, say, what the final scene really means.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My thinking has always been that people writing about comics tend to be writers, so it makes sense if they focus on the writing.  Something similar happens in film reviews with regard to the acting: most critics will point out if a performance is good or bad, but they won&#8217;t go into detail about what the actors are actually doing in the same way they might analyze, say, what the final scene really means.</p>
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		<title>By: MattyK</title>
		<link>http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/09/16/everyones-a-critic-what-we-talk-about-when-were-not-talking-about-the-art/#comment-182064</link>
		<dc:creator>MattyK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 Sep 2007 02:13:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/09/16/everyones-a-critic-what-we-talk-about-when-were-not-talking-about-the-art/#comment-182064</guid>
		<description>I think there is something missing from this discussion that needs to be said.
In the past two or three decades the literary scene has shown acceptance of comic books (it's even clued into the terminology there). However the fine art world, whatever it might be these days, has been less welcoming of comic art: Art as in high-art. 

You're not gonna get an award from the Tait for a splash page printed in a comic, but you are going to get a Hugo award or a Pulitzer for producing watchmen or Maus. 

Critics are simply part of this Literary 'Surge' (if we can manipulate pop terminology for a sec').

I think it is disgusting that this discrepancy exists, but it's nobody's fault but Art Worlders: And it's their loss. 

I believe there has been an unfair exploitation of comic art by the fine art scene that has not paid enough interest or respect to the ongoing artistry involved in comic strip production. 

I really believe this has the biggest effect on common elements of comic book critique. Some of you may have had an art school background, I don't know. But the fact is that comics are accepted as a form of literature much more readily than they are as *art*.

That said, and in parting, comic story telling is an amalgam bordering on psycho-semantic alchemy. This is a difficult language to master, and it may be interesting to debate wether a form that integrates graphic pictogram art and text can be described and critiqued effectively outside of it's own medium.

With respect

MattyK</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think there is something missing from this discussion that needs to be said.<br />
In the past two or three decades the literary scene has shown acceptance of comic books (it&#8217;s even clued into the terminology there). However the fine art world, whatever it might be these days, has been less welcoming of comic art: Art as in high-art. </p>
<p>You&#8217;re not gonna get an award from the Tait for a splash page printed in a comic, but you are going to get a Hugo award or a Pulitzer for producing watchmen or Maus. </p>
<p>Critics are simply part of this Literary &#8216;Surge&#8217; (if we can manipulate pop terminology for a sec&#8217;).</p>
<p>I think it is disgusting that this discrepancy exists, but it&#8217;s nobody&#8217;s fault but Art Worlders: And it&#8217;s their loss. </p>
<p>I believe there has been an unfair exploitation of comic art by the fine art scene that has not paid enough interest or respect to the ongoing artistry involved in comic strip production. </p>
<p>I really believe this has the biggest effect on common elements of comic book critique. Some of you may have had an art school background, I don&#8217;t know. But the fact is that comics are accepted as a form of literature much more readily than they are as *art*.</p>
<p>That said, and in parting, comic story telling is an amalgam bordering on psycho-semantic alchemy. This is a difficult language to master, and it may be interesting to debate wether a form that integrates graphic pictogram art and text can be described and critiqued effectively outside of it&#8217;s own medium.</p>
<p>With respect</p>
<p>MattyK</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Ekstrom</title>
		<link>http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/09/16/everyones-a-critic-what-we-talk-about-when-were-not-talking-about-the-art/#comment-181760</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Ekstrom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 17 Sep 2007 15:06:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/09/16/everyones-a-critic-what-we-talk-about-when-were-not-talking-about-the-art/#comment-181760</guid>
		<description>Johanna, your statement was fine--I was just being rhetorical and giving a response because I think that internally--as people who are analyzing this medium--we should discuss the subject more.

I was saying from an overall standpoint, 
and I may be in the minority, but I recognized that a lot of reviewers tend to stay away from critiquing the art or they butcher their own review with their less than firm grasp of knowledge that would support their statements.  I made a point of "trying" because I think we all recognize that the pictures and the print are simultaneous.

A lot of what our readers are saying under their breaths is, "Who decided that ______ should be reviewing these books?" and to some extent--that's a reasonable question.    

Most of us have had the sense of humor to read "The Buy Pile" once or twice (not to call Hannibal out...) and anyone with any sense can see that he writes one of the worst review columns on the internet.

So I think that we, as people deemed worthy of reviewing the material, should be burdened with a certain amount of responsibility when analyzing these works to be capable of actually doing so with proficiency.

In essence, I agree with your statement--we are reading a book with pictures in it.  The egg has to hatch the chicken, right?  I can refute myself then saying that we drew on the walls of caves before we put balloons near their mouths.

This is material rife for debate.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Johanna, your statement was fine&#8211;I was just being rhetorical and giving a response because I think that internally&#8211;as people who are analyzing this medium&#8211;we should discuss the subject more.</p>
<p>I was saying from an overall standpoint,<br />
and I may be in the minority, but I recognized that a lot of reviewers tend to stay away from critiquing the art or they butcher their own review with their less than firm grasp of knowledge that would support their statements.  I made a point of &#8220;trying&#8221; because I think we all recognize that the pictures and the print are simultaneous.</p>
<p>A lot of what our readers are saying under their breaths is, &#8220;Who decided that ______ should be reviewing these books?&#8221; and to some extent&#8211;that&#8217;s a reasonable question.    </p>
<p>Most of us have had the sense of humor to read &#8220;The Buy Pile&#8221; once or twice (not to call Hannibal out&#8230;) and anyone with any sense can see that he writes one of the worst review columns on the internet.</p>
<p>So I think that we, as people deemed worthy of reviewing the material, should be burdened with a certain amount of responsibility when analyzing these works to be capable of actually doing so with proficiency.</p>
<p>In essence, I agree with your statement&#8211;we are reading a book with pictures in it.  The egg has to hatch the chicken, right?  I can refute myself then saying that we drew on the walls of caves before we put balloons near their mouths.</p>
<p>This is material rife for debate.</p>
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		<title>By: Johanna</title>
		<link>http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/09/16/everyones-a-critic-what-we-talk-about-when-were-not-talking-about-the-art/#comment-181685</link>
		<dc:creator>Johanna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 17 Sep 2007 11:59:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/09/16/everyones-a-critic-what-we-talk-about-when-were-not-talking-about-the-art/#comment-181685</guid>
		<description>Steve, sorry you misunderstood my point. I was responding to the original phrasing of Chris' question, which he didn't reprint. In my experience, those who bash critics for being "incapable" of talking about art (as Chris asked it) most often have a vested interest, yes. 

As for your other point, I read comics because that's where you get the unique blend of pictures and text where together they make more than each separately. I have found comics where looking at the pretty pictures made up for deficiencies in story/text, but I don't praise them for that.  

There's also the factor that I didn't mention: I've written reviews that centered on analyzing the art, its strengths and where it can be removed, and they don't get nearly the response as text-centric reviews do. So maybe critics are just giving the audience what they respond to?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Steve, sorry you misunderstood my point. I was responding to the original phrasing of Chris&#8217; question, which he didn&#8217;t reprint. In my experience, those who bash critics for being &#8220;incapable&#8221; of talking about art (as Chris asked it) most often have a vested interest, yes. </p>
<p>As for your other point, I read comics because that&#8217;s where you get the unique blend of pictures and text where together they make more than each separately. I have found comics where looking at the pretty pictures made up for deficiencies in story/text, but I don&#8217;t praise them for that.  </p>
<p>There&#8217;s also the factor that I didn&#8217;t mention: I&#8217;ve written reviews that centered on analyzing the art, its strengths and where it can be removed, and they don&#8217;t get nearly the response as text-centric reviews do. So maybe critics are just giving the audience what they respond to?</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Ekstrom</title>
		<link>http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/09/16/everyones-a-critic-what-we-talk-about-when-were-not-talking-about-the-art/#comment-181588</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Ekstrom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 17 Sep 2007 06:13:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/09/16/everyones-a-critic-what-we-talk-about-when-were-not-talking-about-the-art/#comment-181588</guid>
		<description>When I was reviewing books for Best Shots, I made a point of including my perspective on the artwork--now, that being said, I was more comfortable writing about the written aspect of these books because--obviously, I was trained to write (not draw) and the act of critiquing something written was just a much easier reflexive action for my brain.

I do think that there is a slight apprehension from a writer's perspective when it comes to critiquing art because of my statement--we're trained to write; therefore, we aren't "experts" when it comes to composition, fluidity, anatomy, perspective and the structure of sequential work.

It's an internal issue--this conflict.  As experienced readers and zealous followers of the medium, you would think that the critics--the most "read" of the readers--could comfortably comment on the stiff nature of ones pencils versus the elegant line quality of another...

Maybe as we progress, the balance of word vs artwork will find even ground--well, I'd like to hope for that--when the two aren't working in unison the industry definitely suffers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When I was reviewing books for Best Shots, I made a point of including my perspective on the artwork&#8211;now, that being said, I was more comfortable writing about the written aspect of these books because&#8211;obviously, I was trained to write (not draw) and the act of critiquing something written was just a much easier reflexive action for my brain.</p>
<p>I do think that there is a slight apprehension from a writer&#8217;s perspective when it comes to critiquing art because of my statement&#8211;we&#8217;re trained to write; therefore, we aren&#8217;t &#8220;experts&#8221; when it comes to composition, fluidity, anatomy, perspective and the structure of sequential work.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s an internal issue&#8211;this conflict.  As experienced readers and zealous followers of the medium, you would think that the critics&#8211;the most &#8220;read&#8221; of the readers&#8211;could comfortably comment on the stiff nature of ones pencils versus the elegant line quality of another&#8230;</p>
<p>Maybe as we progress, the balance of word vs artwork will find even ground&#8211;well, I&#8217;d like to hope for that&#8211;when the two aren&#8217;t working in unison the industry definitely suffers.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Flanagan</title>
		<link>http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/09/16/everyones-a-critic-what-we-talk-about-when-were-not-talking-about-the-art/#comment-181463</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Flanagan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Sep 2007 22:17:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/09/16/everyones-a-critic-what-we-talk-about-when-were-not-talking-about-the-art/#comment-181463</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;my concern with the text is “what is it saying? does it speak to me? how meaningful is it?” In other words, I think the art is and should be secondary to the text. Which may not be a popular opinion, but if I only wanted to look at pretty pictures, I’d go to a museum.&lt;/i&gt;

Which rather invites the retort that, if the art itself never speaks to you or conveys meaning, perhaps you should go and read prose instead.

The idea that only people with a vested interest in a particular artist would want to talk about art in comics is one of the most peculiar I have ever come across.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>my concern with the text is “what is it saying? does it speak to me? how meaningful is it?” In other words, I think the art is and should be secondary to the text. Which may not be a popular opinion, but if I only wanted to look at pretty pictures, I’d go to a museum.</i></p>
<p>Which rather invites the retort that, if the art itself never speaks to you or conveys meaning, perhaps you should go and read prose instead.</p>
<p>The idea that only people with a vested interest in a particular artist would want to talk about art in comics is one of the most peculiar I have ever come across.</p>
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		<title>By: Ryan H</title>
		<link>http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/09/16/everyones-a-critic-what-we-talk-about-when-were-not-talking-about-the-art/#comment-181460</link>
		<dc:creator>Ryan H</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Sep 2007 22:14:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.newsarama.com/2007/09/16/everyones-a-critic-what-we-talk-about-when-were-not-talking-about-the-art/#comment-181460</guid>
		<description>I think part of the reason stems from the fact that it is the writers that get promoted more than the artists.  For the past few years, Marvel and DC have been working hard to try and create as much name recognition for their creators as possible.  They want to be able to sell their books on the strength of the names as much as the title.

The problem with this is that it is that most artists can't d more than one or possibly two monthly titles, where as some writers seem to handle half a dozen (whether they should is a completely different post).  So, it is the writers who get played up more.  The books are sold as "(insert title here) by (Writers Name), with (Artists Name).

So, since the writers are billed as more important, they get more mind space and more review time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think part of the reason stems from the fact that it is the writers that get promoted more than the artists.  For the past few years, Marvel and DC have been working hard to try and create as much name recognition for their creators as possible.  They want to be able to sell their books on the strength of the names as much as the title.</p>
<p>The problem with this is that it is that most artists can&#8217;t d more than one or possibly two monthly titles, where as some writers seem to handle half a dozen (whether they should is a completely different post).  So, it is the writers who get played up more.  The books are sold as &#8220;(insert title here) by (Writers Name), with (Artists Name).</p>
<p>So, since the writers are billed as more important, they get more mind space and more review time.</p>
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