So, in this week’s Lying In The Gutters, Gail Simone is quoted talking about the reason why Marvel has so few female writers:
I think it’s more likely that aspiring female writers know that Marvel isn’t their best shot.
I like Marvel. I have a lot of friends at Marvel. But there is definitely a Howard Stern/partytime/fratboy/strip club element.
Again, I like Marvel. But when I was there, it was INEVITABLE that every female who left or was let go would be referred to as a ‘crazy bitch’ at some point. I don’t blame any one person for it, but it is something that could bite them in the ass if they’re not careful.
And on the flipside, big kudos to editors like Mike Marts who could NOT have been more gracious and welcoming. And Joe Quesada has been nothing but nice to me as well. It’s not the individuals, it’s just sort of an institutionalized faux ‘badboys’ environment, to my mind.
As a final caveat, let me add that it’s been some years since I was there and it all may have changed since then.
Brian Michael Bendis isn’t too happy about her comments:
i call bullshit on this on so many levels gail. i would tell you privately, but you said it publicly. there are so many female editors at marvel, i can’t even imagine what you’re referring to.
marvel hired you gail. how is that sexist?
for future reference, if i pitch something and it doesn’t get approved, it doesn’t make that company anti semetic or anti bald- its bullshit and you had no example of any of this and i think you really owe the editors, good people with families, an apology.
Gail responds:
I said it because it was TRUE, Brian. Which, sorry, is the ultimate defense against a post like this. It happened. Since the people it happened to were friends of mine, it’s bothered me a bit, particularly in light of some recent comments from Marvel staff regarding female creators and the lack thereof.
On the other hand, I talked with Joe about it at length today, and he was very cool and straightforward about it. I think the world of Joe and always have. And he explained a few things that cleared a few things up. I said it, I stand by it, but after speaking with Joe, I had planned on clarifying a few points but haven’t been able to get ahold of Rich.
If you think I said it because I didn’t get a script approved, you are very mistaken. Aside from Night Nurse (which was cancelled before print), I don’t even know what you’re talking about. I have no grudge against Marvel, not even a speck, and I’ve seen plenty of ugly comments about DC here and elsewhere that don’t match my experience at all. I support Marvel creators constantly and have defended Marvel and Joe many, many times. The notion that I didn’t get something published at Marvel suddenly makes me take revenge after years of saying nothing but positive things is just silly.
It happened five years ago, and my knowledge of what’s going on at Marvel is practically zip at this point, which I acknowledged in my post. You know full well that stuff gets thrown up at Rich’s column with no context whatsover, and that’s just the way it is. If you want to talk about it in private, I’d be happy to tell you exactly who this was said about. Send me an email or call and I’ll tell you.
(She later adds: “I’m not fighting. I get why Brian was mad, and I wish he would take a moment to think why a thing like this would bother me, as well. But I did fucking say it was five years ago and that it may all have changed since then, AND that Joey had been nothing but gracious to me. Since I can name names (in private) with utter confidence, I find it sad (but not wholly unexpected) that I’d get shit for bringing it up. Brian, I have nothing but respect for you. I’m sending you an email.”)
The response of the other Bendis Boarders is somewhat split:
“Holy FUCK, i just ejaculated on my ultimate spider-man vol. 7 trade paperback!! Thats Ultimate Nick Fury talking right there!!! (Not taking sides or anything, just never seen bendis post in this manner).”
“i think gail was appropriately delicate with her opinions. i also think bendis is coming off as a little defensive and a bit aggressive here.”
“I hate to see you guys fight. It frightens me. Stop yelling at each other mom an dad!!!”
That’s it. The internet is finally breaking in half. Which side are you on?
(Thanks, Stephanie.)
August 7th, 2006 at 6:43 pm
Bendis is so full of crap! The lady was just voicing her opinion. No where in her post did she name names but she in fact, praised certain editiors for generally being wonderful.
What the F**K was Bendis reading that I wasn’t?
August 7th, 2006 at 7:14 pm
Wait. I’m confused. Is this just anothe Cival War crossover?
August 7th, 2006 at 7:28 pm
I’d guess Simone touched a nerve with Bendis.
His response contains “some of my best friends are”, “one counter disproves the trend” an ad-hominem, an unsupported call for an apology (shifting the goalposts?) and dragging in hitherto unmentioned families.
That’s like a quintifecta (?) of nonsense and passive-agressive bullshitting in one post.
Given that he could have answered calmy along the lines of “not my experience at all, can’t imagine even if respect her perceptions” _I_ find that telling.
It’s certainly ironic that in response to her talking about perceiving a sexist atmosphere he essentially puts on his daddy hat and explain to her from on high how she sees it all wrong and should apologise.
August 7th, 2006 at 7:48 pm
Bendis’ reaction isn’t suprising. Any critique towards Marvel or Queseda, however slight or severe, is usually attacked by Bendis or JMS (I’m surpised he hasn’t attacked her yet). I use DC making a snide comment towards Queseda as an example. After years of being attacked by Queseda in every media outlet he could, after setting up false rumors, someone at DC finally says something against him and JMS went ballistic.
Obviously, that isn’t as severe as women being harrassed in the workplace. But, it isn’t Bendis being “big daddy” and being sexist.
She could have posted that Marvel doesn’t provide enough bubble gum to their writers and one of them would go on some long diatribe about how they always have bubble gum and everyone they know has bubble gum and if she wanted bubble gum, then she should have simply asked.
So, women being harrassed, needing bubble gum, doesn’t matter. Marvel is incapable of doing anything wrong and if anyone dares say something, then they have a hidden agenda or they didn’t get a book published.
August 7th, 2006 at 9:19 pm
Gail never said that her pitches were turned down; nothing of the sort, in fact.
In FACT, she was allowed to return to Agent X to send the character off as he deserved. I think Gail was happy when she left Marvel — in the sense that, she was content, but figured DC was going to offer her something that they weren’t.
Bendis’ reaction seems.. overt.
He could have simply disagreed.
August 7th, 2006 at 9:46 pm
Bendis’ response was dishonest.
“there are so many female editors at marvel, i can’t even imagine what you’re referring to.”
She didn’t say there aren’t. He is misrepresenting what she said with his response.
“marvel hired you gail. how is that sexist?”
She didn’t say it was. He’s misrepresenting what she said and ignoring her claim. She could have said she was manhandled in the workplace, but the fact that she was hired wouldn’t make it not groping. Non-sequitur.
“for future reference, if i pitch something and it doesn’t get approved, it doesn’t make that company anti semetic or anti bald- its bullshit and you had no example of any of this”
Her claim said nothing about not getting a pitch approved and there is no sign that that is her standard of judgement. Again, Bendis is misrepresenting her.
“and i think you really owe the editors, good people with families, an apology.”
He is putting effort into being offended and indignant. He is actively trying to not understand what she said.
August 7th, 2006 at 10:05 pm
Yeesh. Next week tune in to Bendis over-reacting to a statement that Priest makes. What makes me respect Gail even more is her insistence upon trying to keep the discussion civil (heh, I said civil) instead of turning it into an infinite crisis (heh, I said infinite and crisis) of throwing bravado feces at each other. I think Quesada can defend himself pretty well without having Bendis unintentionally coming off as unsolicited lap dog for Marvel. And to the fellow who spent his “wad” on Utlimate Spidey TPB, surprisingly enough getting the pages to stick together like that neither preserves the mint condition or improves the value. Some might say it improves the strength of the narrative, but I’ll leave that for others to opine.
August 8th, 2006 at 1:30 am
Wow, I thought Bendis came off a little harsh, but you folks are down-right crucifying him. I think he took it personally, and reacted as such, but you people… you’re just being ridiculous.
August 8th, 2006 at 1:59 am
What’s so ridiculous, they are just pointing out what’s there. Bendis reacted like hurt college fratboy, which is fine, but he should have waited to calm down and post something civil. But this is Bendis…
August 8th, 2006 at 5:31 am
the problem is that Gail’s statements implied and gave the impression of Marvel being a sexiest club and that prevented women from getting work at Marvel.
first she said” think it’s more likely that aspiring female writers know that Marvel is not their best shot”
then she generalized” like Marvel. I have a lot of friends at Marvel. But there is definitely a Howard Stern/partytime/fratboy/strip club element.
Again, I like Marvel. But when I was there, it was INEVITABLE that every female who left or was let go would be referred to as a ‘crazy bitch’ at some point. I don’t blame any one person for it, but it is something that could bite them in the ass if they’re not careful”
and then she made 2 exceptions to the rule”And on the flipside, big kudos to editors like Mike Marts who could NOT have been more gracious and welcoming. And Joe Quesada has been nothing but nice to me as well”
and finished with reaffirming her generalization”it’s just sort of an institutionalized faux ‘badboys’ environment, to my mind”
so i think everyone at Marvel other than Mike Marts and Joe Quesada have a right to be offended
August 8th, 2006 at 10:15 am
“there are so many female editors at marvel,”
There’s three! One of them edits one of my favorite books.
Bendis overreacting again. Sigh… he should just chill. I mean, look how Joe Q himself handled it.
August 8th, 2006 at 10:24 am
She didn’t actually say a word about women not being able to get work. She was talking about how women are made to feel once they do get work there, which implies exactly the reverse, i.e. that women can and do find work there. She also pointed out that women are made the objects of sexist joking once they stop working there, which is sadly common in most industries. Most other industries, however, are not so intimately involved with (and closely monitored by) their consumer base. But in any case, the fact remains that it does create a work environment that feels to varying degrees hostile to a number of otherwise talented and dedicated folks. This places the company at a crossroads of sorts, in that its employees can get all huffy and defensive or it could take these minor criticisms to heart, end the hostility and get ready to welcome a flood of new talent that I maintain is totally out there. I know I, for one, would rather have that talent and dedication in the same place as the goods I like to consume, and despite the usual tenor of my attitude I’m pretty confident that it’s going to get better
August 8th, 2006 at 12:33 pm
Everyone needs to chill out, pause, and think about what they’re saying.
August 8th, 2006 at 2:39 pm
Yeah…Bendis overreacted…Gail gingerly made her comments. Bendis does use some really ineffectual defenses of Marvel in his comments. “They hired you, Gail…how is that sexist?” Many women and minorities have been HIRED but then found a GLASS CEILING which would still be evidence of sexism or racism. I’m not saying the charges are accurate…heck, Gail doesn’t even say the charges are currently accurate…but Bendis and his kneejerk reaction are doing no one any favors.
August 8th, 2006 at 2:39 pm
On the Internet? NEVER!!!
August 8th, 2006 at 3:15 pm
so this is about Bendis now?
August 8th, 2006 at 3:42 pm
I think that it’s safe to say that it’s about Jesus Christ and him crucified…
August 8th, 2006 at 5:51 pm
Oh, it’s ALWAYS been about Bendis…
August 8th, 2006 at 10:28 pm
I’m just dismayed no one appreciated my use of civil, infinite or crisis. I think I weakened my humor with bravado feces. It sounded great in my head, but read lame on the actual screen. And hey, Hunter, we really should ask ourselves more often WWBD (What Would Bendis Do?) when faced with messiah-like situations.
August 9th, 2006 at 12:24 am
Tim, I’ve always been more of a Millar fan, so I’ll have to ask WWMD. If he doesn’t answer my prayer, then I’ll got with WWBD, I swear.
August 10th, 2006 at 11:00 am
Nobody asks WWJWD (What Would Joss Whedon Do)?
Just curious.
the New Girl at Marvel
August 10th, 2006 at 2:38 pm
I’m always asking WWJWD. Then again I’m a fangirl.
August 10th, 2006 at 3:16 pm
I find Bendis HIGH-larious (like, for serious - he’s very funny). You can just *tell* he doesn’t think before he writes. It’s all “OMG WHY DO YOU HAVE TO BE A HATER, GAIL?!”
August 10th, 2006 at 4:35 pm
Typical Bendis overeacting and making an ass out of himself. Why dont we talk about the negative things he said about puertoricans on his website. That actually got Tom Beland rilled up, yeah no one touched that story guess its not “news worthy”…
August 10th, 2006 at 8:50 pm
On the matter that got my old friend Tom Beland riled, please do me a favor and give me a link to this supposed display of ignorance on Mr. Bendis’ part. As a reader of blogs as you clearly are Mr. Arroyo, you know that sometimes a story doesn’t become newsworthy until someone makes a reporter aware of it (as blogs often do). Comic book journalists rarely shy away from controversy, in fact we seem to wallow in it, so give us the link and I imagine someone will bite.
August 14th, 2006 at 11:51 am
Is Brian’s volatile response a sign of something we don’t know?
Holy crap - is Brian Michael Bendis a woman?!? :p
August 14th, 2006 at 5:16 pm
That explains it! Expect another outburst from him in about…oh, 28 days.
Seriously though, what an unthoughtful and unreasoned response to Gail Simone’s comments.
Pass the man some Midol.
August 15th, 2006 at 10:28 am
“Nobody asks WWJWD (What Would Joss Whedon Do)?”
Write the worst X-Men story in the past fifteen years?